Board Thread:General Wiki Discussion/@comment-36052213-20180802015552/@comment-3563804-20180802144311

MrDupin wrote: I am sorry, but I have to. I don't believe what you provided is grounds for demotion (although I will have a talk with Helel for some of the things you brought up).

A NOTE TO VOTERS

Before I give my reasons, I want to point out that votes that don't provide a reasoning for the vote will not count. It doesn't matter if you have something personal for or against Helel, this is not a poll to determine if he is well liked or not. This is a poll to see if he is fit to be an admin. Personal feelings towards Helel are not valid reasons for voting here.

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1) I agree that Helel didn't handle this as well as he could have, but there's nothing more to it. It wasn't unacceptably hostile, just a mildly mean comment. That's all this is. If you can find more comments like that, this might be important. Just a handful of rude comments (in this case one) don't give us much information and is certainly not grounds for demotion.

2) Helel's original comment was perfectly reasonable and was not rude at all. If you can't handle the image of making out with your non-preferred gender, then this wiki might not be for you since there's a ton of shocking content. Helel's second comment was a joke at Icy, who is a very good friend of Helel (if you need it, proof that Icy and Helel are close).

3) I will admit Helel's comment on Humboldt was not the best. It was mild criticism in the form of an inside joke. I agree that afterwards Helel might have misread the situation and joked around while Humboldt was being serious. You can't fault him for that, we all have awkward moments, especially online when we can't read the other person's emotions.

4) I agree that the comment was not as abrasive as most comments on Emp's Salt Mines, but it still was salty, so technically it fits the bill. I personally wouldn't do a Salt Mines thing unless I was getting all the vitriol Emp was getting, but I can't fault him for having such a page. Finally, I agree that the last comment isn't that salty to be added there, so maybe he should remove it for consistency's sake, but this is not relevant here. It's 'eh'. I would suggest to Helel to put real salt in there to not dilute the content of the page.

5) I agree that he shouldn't have ignored you, that was rude (although I have no context since I am not really on Discord). Again though, unless this is happening en large, I don't see an issue with it.

On the transphobia: This does not look good, but out of context I can't really form a concrete opinion on this. You just put the messages Helel wrote without providing context. If Helel was bullying you, it is a serious offence. But if it was a two-sided match, I don't think anything can be done. We all know how online pissing fights go, unfortunately.

I will talk to him about the nature of the comments, since I do not want people to feel unwelcome coming into the wiki. I know that Helel (just like me) is from the Balkans, a very rough part of the world where only the rough (or the rich, of course) survive. It's a very traditional and old-fashioned place, so I can see where these comments come from. I will reach out to him to hash this out.

6) I agree the blog shouldn't have been deleted and I will talk to him about this too. Again though, it's an isolated incident so it's not grounds for demotion. If he consistently deletes/censors opinions, then it's not cool and we have an issue. If you can provide more such evidence, I might reconsider.

Also, as HopelessNightOwl has pointed out, Helel deleted the blog because he thought the leaked audio was illegal. When informed otherwise, he restored the blog and hashed things out with the original poster and all parties were satisfied. If this is true, this shows that Helel is fit to be an admin.

7) I agree that calling for raids is unacceptable (and against the rules of wikis), but this is not that. He simply asked people to hop over and voice their opinion. It's not raiding. I believe Helel acted on emotion because of the history between Slimebeast and Banning. It's a bitter story, and Slimebeast posted a private conversation between Banning and him despite Banning specifically asking for the dialogue to not be posted. I think this is why Helel jumped to action, Slimebeast seems to be out to get Banning.

Having said that, I am glad that Cleric intervened because I don't want any more trouble with Slimebeast. Still, it's not against the rules and it's not grounds for demotion.

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All in all, I believe Helel is fit to be an admin and the evidence provided is not grounds for demotion. Remember, you might personally dislike him, but that doesn't make him unfit to be an admin. Its like i said all he was doing was his job, okay i know i repeat myself, but i think  Lokintas really has some issue against him that she might not understand herself.